Step 10 – God, Help Me See My Reflection for This Day w/Nikita B

Narrator: This is Pathway to Recovery, an SA Lifeline Foundation podcast featuring hosts Tara McCausland, who is the SA Lifeline Executive Director, and Justin B., a sex addict living in long-term recovery. We have conversations with experts and individuals who understand the pathway to healing from sexual addiction and betrayal trauma because we believe that recovering individuals leads to the healing of families. Welcome to the Pathway to Recovery Podcast.

Justin B.: I'm Justin B. I am a son of an all-powerful and perfectly loving God and a recovering sex addict. And I love living in the miracle of recovery, the ups and downs of it every day, one day at a time. And I'm here today, sitting down with one of my really good friends and brothers in SAL, Nikitas B. Nikitas, why don't you introduce yourself? Just tell us a little bit about yourself, why you're in the rooms of SAL, and then we'll move into this.

Nikitas B.: Thanks, Justin. I appreciate you getting me on here. Thank you for all the work and service that you do. It's, uh, I love being a part of it with you. Yeah, I entered the rooms of SAL back in the early part of 2021. I was homeless. I was suicidal. I was frantic. And I am grateful that God put you guys on my online screen when I went searching for sex and love addiction. I think my first spiritual awakening was when I became aware of my ignorance with all of the ignorant things that I was doing in my life at that time.

I was overwhelmed with emotions. I was overwhelmed with my self-will. I was one of those people that always thought that they could do it all. I could never show weakness. And turns out the more vulnerable I get, the more freedom I have in this program. I think I qualify for this program. I definitely have ruined my life because of My addictions to lust and sex and validation, and now I'm not there anymore. Like, I'm just simply not at that point anymore where I was three years ago.

I feel so much more, so much more freedom and love for others that it's hard for me to not be so grateful where I'm at this point in my life.

Justin B.: Hmm. And Nikitas. Not to like sit here and pat you on the back or inflate your head any, but I think I may have been in the first meeting or one of the first meetings you attended with SAL. And I remember the first time I saw you, I was like, holy crap, this guy is a mess. He's angry. He's just a mess. And to watch the transformation over the last, what, 3, 4 years has just been— Yeah. Well, God's hand is in it.

And I love watching the light in your eyes. And I love watching and feeling the energy you bring to the meetings. Thank you for being a guest here, brother. Thank you. Yeah, you're very welcome. All right, to those of you out there, you know that we have been walking through the steps of recovery one step at a time over the last several months. And today we're talking about Step 10 with Nikitas. And what I'm going to do here before we get into this is just to remind us all what the steps of recovery are for SAL.

I'm just going to read up through step 10, one step at a time. And then we'll get in and talk a little bit about your progression, Nikitas, in these steps. And then we'll land on step 10 and talk about that. Step 1, we admitted that we were powerless over sexual addiction, that our lives had become unmanageable. 2, came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. 3, made a decision to turn our will and lives over to the care of God as we understood him.

4, made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. 5, admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs. 6, were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character. 7, humbly asked him to remove our shortcomings. 8, Made a list of all persons we had harmed and became willing to make amends to them all. Nine made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.

And step ten continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it. So Nikitas, those are the steps of recovery, basically word for word out of the Book of Alcoholics Anonymous, with only a couple of words changed for SAL specific. Talk to us a little bit about your progression through the steps as you've been in recovery.

Nikitas B.: Yeah, so I did not want to be in these rooms. That first meeting that you spoke about earlier, I was looking at you guys like, this is not me. I did not want to admit it. I was looking at all the differences instead of the similarities. And that's when I, like when I spoke before, like I wasn't ignorant to my ignorance anymore, was really when I Started looking for the similarities and not look for the differences.

When guys were sharing and then the stuff that we were reading out of the books to step into action and the Light Book and the Big Book, it took me a while to get to my step 1 because I was using 2 out of the 3 steps, which was fellowship and meetings. That's all I was counting on. I was counting on Going, getting to the meetings, and I was counting on calling the guys, but I wasn't working the steps.

And those 3 things is a 3-legged stool. I'm not gonna be able to support myself. I was just telling someone today actually that when it's a 2-legged stool, I still have my feet on the ground supporting myself on that 2-legged stool. And the only way that God really takes over is when I lift my feet off that stool. Right. And have that third leg there to hold me up.

Justin B.: Oh my gosh, Nikitas, that is one of the coolest images that I've ever seen in relation to self-relying on self to keep me afloat. And it just doesn't work for very long. No. Ah, beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. Go ahead and continue on what you were saying. Yeah.

Nikitas B.: So I was actually talking to a sponsee that I, that I took on a year ago and He's been dancing and prancing around working the steps and people see, and I use that analogy and it totally made sense about self-will. Like I have my feet on the ground, still sitting on a 2-legged stool. But yeah, I didn't understand why at our meetings for SAL specifically that we would list our character defects and our fruits of addiction and stuff.

And the reason being is because I'm also a forgetaholic. I forget a lot of things. That are good for me. I forget the— I don't want to remember the things I have done. So I have to remember that my— the things that brought me here were my character defects, my dishonesty, my aggressiveness, my deceiving attitude, my reactive attitude, how egotistical and close-minded and selfish. And I love living in self-pity and defiance and blaming others and gluttony and Those are the things that got me into these rooms of recovery, and they still creep up.

They still come up as I go through this healing process. However, now that I have the tools of recovery, it's easier to look at myself. And that's what Step 10 is for me. It's about looking at myself daily, but it's really, it's amazing that I can actually sit back and self-reflect. Yeah. And one of the things I do in my step 10 is I give a little prayer and that's all it is. Like, God, help me see my reflection from this day.

I need to be able to see my reflection, an honest reflection of my day and of myself.

Justin B.: So as you went through the steps, let's pause on step like 4. As you did your step 4, what was that self-revealing inventory process in your experience to you?

Nikitas B.: So I know typically a lot of people are afraid of step 4, but for me, I welcomed it. I loved getting deeper and deeper in my feelings. One of the things I wish I didn't do was when I would discover like an amends that I would have to make at the beginning of my step 4, I would call people and try to make that amends before I would get there. And I made that mistake a couple times. I wasn't ready for those amends.

So I wish I did that a little bit differently. However, I did learn from it. I basically would go downtown, With my iPad and stuff. And I would sit there with a cup of coffee and I would spend a couple hours there every time and just be able to reflect on those things. Like, I wrote out my Step 4 like I was going through it at that time and what I was feeling, because I found a lot of relief that way.

And it made me realize that it was 99% of the time, it was my self-will. Like, it wasn't somebody doing something to me. I was causing that because I thought that was the right thing for me. I thought that's what I had to do during those moments.

Justin B.: How big of a revelation was that to you to realize, I am the one who is responsible for my own negative emotions and my own fears and my own harms that I've done?

Nikitas B.: It sat in a lot of shame for a little bit and a lot of guilt in that. I got into the program when I was 45.

Speaker 4: I'm 48 now.

Nikitas B.: In March, I'll be 49. And I thought like I ruined my life. And now I look at it a little differently. I have the next 45 years to fix that. And I wasn't ready to receive before 45. I didn't have the mental capacity to do that. I thought I knew everything. I was a know-it-all. I still have that know-it-all mentality at times, and I have to get humble. But it felt great, actually. Step 4 felt great. Going through that storm felt amazing for me.

I know other people shy away from it, but the deeper I got, the more freedom I got. And then after I gave my Step 5 away, it felt like nothing's going to stop me as long as I continue to reach for God. Right. nothing is going to stop me. And that's what I've experienced. I've done my step 4 a while ago and it's been an absolute miracle where I'm at right now.

Justin B.: So I want to stop there for just a second, Nikitas, because I know a little bit of your story. I know a lot of your story. Have things tried to stop you since step 4 and 5?

Nikitas B.: Yes, a lot of things. I've, yes, a lot of things have tried to stop me. I'm still battling and I'm still in a court case. That I'm trudging along the road of my happy destiny trying to get over because of my past action. Yes. However, I have a lot more serenity with everything. I'm not that person anymore. I'm thinking clearer. It says in the Big Book, where was it? It's like I react sanely and normally now, right?

And that's the truth. I react sanely. I'm not reacting. Hold on, let me rephrase that. At times I could be reacting. Yeah. Right. But most of the time I respond now, like I take a step back, I'm able to pause. Growing up, one of the many beautiful things my father told me was, count to 10, Nikitas, before you say anything, count to 10. And I'm always like, yeah, whatever, Dad, whatever. But that's what program has taught me is when I am able to pause, That's when God gets in.

And when God gets in, that's when I become humble. And when I become humble, that's when I become willing. And the only way that starts is when I pause. And that, that's what the steps have taught me.

Justin B.: Yeah. And that pause concept is such a powerful concept. It's a Step 11 concept, but I think it's identified in Step 10. One of my mentors in recovery who taught me the concept of, of two-way prayer, how I currently practice Step 11 for the most part. He said, you know what, if I'm not in step 10 and I'm not watching, I won't know what the hell to pray about, is what he says, for step 11. I gotta watch so I know what to pause and pray about.

And that's been a really powerful thing for me to look at and dive into. So is there anything else on those first 9 steps that you'd like to touch base on from your experience? Before we jump into step 10.

Nikitas B.: Yeah. 6 and 7 never ends. It's always there daily. My character defects always want to show up. My default is to my self-reliance. So when I— step 6 and 7, I knew it wasn't going to be just a one-time thing. I just didn't realize how often they come up. And I'm grateful that I can actually see them come up. I actually am aware of them now because it gives me an opportunity to show up to be the person that I want to be, which is kind and loving and empathetic and compassionate.

Like all the things I wanted that I thought I was during those first 45 years. I thought I was these, right? Because I'm entitled and I'm this person that, right? But I had no idea what I was doing. And now I do a little bit. Now I do with God. As long as I keep reaching for God, I feel like I have the understanding or God will make it aware to me when I'm doing it, those things, because that's what step 10 is.

When I'm aware that I'm showing up, I'm being aggressive, I'm being egotistical, I'm being judgmental and critical. God somehow shows up in those times and they, what are you doing again?

Speaker 4: And that's when I have to make the amends.

Nikitas B.: But steps 6 and 7, my character defects are going to show up and I have to ask God to remove the ones that he thinks I don't need anymore. Because there might be some ones that I do need that I don't want anymore. But it's not on my time. It's on his time. Whenever he wants to remove them in that opportunity, he's going to show it to me.

Justin B.: Are you willing to share a time recently where one of these character defects Wanted to come out and just pounce, but you paused, you gave it to God, and a miraculous type interaction happened instead of a potential contentious interaction. Yes.

Nikitas B.: Yes. So a couple of months ago, my spouse was going through a hard time and she wasn't feeling right one day and stuff. And she came to me and wanted to end the relationship. And my first reaction when that kind of stuff happens, it's like, this was like 2, like 3 years into my recovery and I'm still not good enough.

Speaker 4: That was my first reaction and I wanted to blow up, but I didn't. I paused and the first person I called was my sponsor and he was fantastic.

Nikitas B.: And the first thing he told me was to read pages 66 through 68 in the Big Book. And read it as many times as I need to. He also asked me, where do I find myself closest to God? And that's in nature and going to church. So I was instructed to go on hikes and go to the beach and go to church the next day because this happened on a Saturday. And what was really great about that is that it shows in the Big Book here.

It's like we avoid retaliation and arguments. You know, we wouldn't treat sick people that way. It made me to the point like, I got humble enough to be there for my spouse. I was humble enough to be there for my spouse, and that took all weekend. And I didn't retaliate. I didn't argue. I just listened. And when she wanted to speak, I listened. I active listened with her, asked her questions. And then when it's time for me to speak, I really didn't want to.

I didn't feel safe enough to do it, so I held off. I held off until we actually Spoke a couple days later. It was on Monday when we actually spoke, and it turns out that what she said to me, she didn't really mean. She had a reaction. She reacted. She didn't respond, and she's allowed to do that also because she is human and trying her best too. And I never had that attitude before. When someone tried to hurt me, they tried to hurt me.

That was it, period. It wasn't anything about to do with them. I just was all about to do with me. And if I wasn't able to pause and read that chapter, how it works, it'd make me realize that, hey, people are going through their stuff. They might hurt me even if I don't appreciate what they're saying or doing. I don't want to make it worse. And I didn't make it worse. Nikitas, 4 or 5 years ago, would have blown the house off.

I would have ruined that relationship that weekend. I would have left. And I'm just so grateful that I had a SPOT to walk me through that because that's what the program shows you, is to call somebody when I'm not sane, when I'm not thinking right. Pause, pray, call someone. And that's what happened.

Justin B.: Yeah. And I just look at that, Nikitas, and I call it a straight up miracle. And not because it was you involved, it's because it's a human involved. We as humans and we as addicts, I'll speak for myself, just react in those types of situations where it seems this is a survival type thing. This is life and death almost. Right. And I'm going to jump in and try and react in a way that's going to defend me.

And if other people die in the process, that's just Collateral damage. So yes, thank you for sharing that with us.

Nikitas B.: Yeah, that's exactly what happens with me. Like, I don't care about anything else. I will burn the house down, blow up anything. I got this. That's where I was when I joined SAL. I was homeless, suicidal, right? Because I blew up that relationship and I didn't want to blow it up. Yeah. Self-will run riot. Does not work for— does not work for me.

Justin B.: No, me neither, brother. All right, let's jump to step 10. I'm going to reread step 10 real quick. The principle behind it: continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it. Talk to us today, Nikitas, what step 10 looks like to you in your daily practice.

Speaker 4: Okay, so the White Book on page 130 says, what better chance towards true union than in the heat of misunderstanding, acknowledgement of wrong, and forgiveness. It welds people at the very heart of their being where they hurt the most. So the reason I love that so much is because I really try to find fault in everybody and judge and criticize. And when I get to that point, I love the fact that I'm able to Break that wall down and be able to acknowledge my wrong to that person that I did that.

And like I said before, the more vulnerable I get with people, the more connected I get. And that's really all I ever wanted in life, even though I didn't know that's what I wanted. It was just connection. So yeah, when something goes wrong during my day, I'll give you an example.

Nikitas B.: And in fact, that When I want to be in the problem, because that happens often with me as well.

Speaker 4: I have the case of the eff it, like eff this, eff that. I don't want to do anything, right? So when I sit in that problem is when I really realize like, hey, something's going on. And the first thing I do is I pause and I do a really simple prayer. And I've told many guys this as well. It doesn't take long. It's like, just, God, help me be the man you want me to be right now.

Or if it's really involving my kids, God, help me be the father you need me to be right now. For work, help me be the employee you need me to be right now. It doesn't matter what it is. Just that little short prayer gets me to pause. And when that happened, it's limitless how much recovery I could get into that and be able to feel freedom doing my step 10, making my amends, writing things down. The spot check one is the most difficult for me because it's in the moment.

It's when my adrenaline is running high. It's when my emotions are running high. It's hard for me to see that.

Justin B.: Why don't we pause there just a sec? Talk to us. What does a spot check mean to somebody who's like, what does— what is a spot check inventory?

Speaker 4: Yeah, spot check is right then and there when you notice, when you're actually aware Of something that— so that's the first thing you have to be aware of, right? If you're not aware of it, you're just ignorant to what just happened and you're not going to find it. But once you realize, for instance, objectifying, right? It's not my first thought. It's not my first vision. Once I see skin, I look, it's what I do with my second and third thoughts that matter.

Right. But if I'm there and I catch myself what I'm doing and I'm still doing it, that's when I need to call a brother. That to me is a spot check. When I notice I'm doing something that I am not supposed to be doing for my own recovery, not because someone is telling me, but because it doesn't feel good for me. My heart knows, my intentions know when I'm not doing something that is in alignment with how I want to live.

My first reaction is to call someone and to let them know what's going on. So surrender is a spot check to me. I don't know exactly how the book says it, but spot check to me is once I'm knowing what I'm doing, if I'm not able to change that behavior, I need to call someone and surrender it.

Justin B.: Now let's go into maybe more in-depth step 10. Yeah.

Speaker 4: When I talk to you guys, I usually, I received a template from my current sponsor and it's a template for a nightly check-in. And I think it's a wonderful check-in. Do we owe an apology? Were we resentful, selfish, dishonest, or afraid? And actually this was like word for word in the big book on page, yeah, it's on 84. It's like word for word, resentful, selfish, dishonest, or afraid.

Nikitas B.: Do I owe an apology?

Speaker 4: Have we kept something to ourselves which should be discussed with others or at once? So any secrets? Was I kind and loving towards all?

Nikitas B.: What could we have done better?

Speaker 4: Where were we thinking of ourselves most of the time, or were we thinking of what we could do for others and what we could pack into the stream of light? So that's basically service. Where was I of service for the day? A short little prayer. And then corrective measures. Corrective measures is a big one for me, especially when it's like something that's going to change my trajectory for the next day.

Nikitas B.: So I'm waking up knowing that I need to change something.

Speaker 4: I also added 3 things because I'm in a program called RCA, Recovering Couples Anonymous. I think it's a wonderful program. And in there they talk about a lot about our coupleship. Like, I like the word coupleship better than relationship because I have many relationships with friends, family, loved ones, right? But when it comes to a coupleship, it just sounds more, it's like us.

Nikitas B.: So what has my partner done to help the coupleship?

Speaker 4: And the reason I love that so much is I'm really good at kitchen sinking, putting everything in. Like when my spouse does something that I don't agree with or have judgment or criticism towards, like I could point out all her faults. And this makes me realize, hey, she does good things. And the truth is she does. She's an amazing spouse, right? But it's like, what has she done to help the coupleship? Which makes you reflect on all the good things she does.

And then it turns it right back on me. The next question is, what have I done to harm the coupleship?

Nikitas B.: And the third one is, what have we done together as a couple to harm or enhance the coupleship?

Speaker 4: So those are 3 things I've added to my step 10.

Justin B.: Yeah. So a lot of times both The husband and the wife in SAL are working the program at the same time, God willing, and we hope that's the case more often than not. Talk to us a little bit about how RCA may enhance or differ from what you understand the SAL things are, the way we do this with our spouses in this process.

Nikitas B.: So what I love about RCP is that they have guidelines.

Speaker 4: They give you rules. And one of them is, one, it's okay to feel. 2, it's okay to make mistakes. 3, it's okay to have respectful conflict. 4, it's okay to have needs and ask for them to be met. 5 is important to respect others and everyone in the conversation. We avoid self-righteous statements, baiting or button-pushing statements, case-building statements, and taking or sharing of another person's inventory. Love that so much because it's so easy for me to develop this inventory. Yeah, it's important to respect others and to avoid self-put-downs and self-pity.

And it really is our spiritual foundation. When you see here what you hear, when you feel it, stay here.

Nikitas B.: Like, I love these guidelines.

Justin B.: And in the meetings with RCA, you're meeting together, you're with your spouse in this meeting with other people and their spouses, correct?

Speaker 4: Correct. And there's— and people in there are All over the— both people are doing their separate individual programs and they want to come together, which is the case for myself and my spouse. There's people there that are just at the— never done any recovery or any kind of 12-step program, and they're literally there on their last leg trying to save their marriage. There's people there that have ones in recovery and ones not in recovery. It's amazing because the group that I go to is on Sunday nights.

Nikitas B.: There's like 30 couples.

Speaker 4: It's like 60 people on this meeting. And it's profound work. We also have a sponsor couple that we meet with twice a month and we work the steps with them. And we do this thing called the meeting of 2, which is amazing, profound work to do a meeting of 2 because it's simply just active listening the entire time to your partner.

Nikitas B.: giving no feedback, no anything.

Speaker 4: It's amazing. It's helped my, it's helped my coupleship. When we first joined, it scared me. And that was the reason why I know I need to do it. And now we're about 6 months into it. And it's amazing. We have beautiful conflict together. Hmm. And we know how to go through that process in a respectful way and to speak. And it's wonderful.

Nikitas B.: Like, I love SAL. They've changed my life. Yeah.

Speaker 4: But RCA is really teaching me how to be gentle with my partner. Yeah.

Justin B.: And this being an SAL and SA Lifeline Foundation production, I almost feel awkward with bringing this in. But at the same time, I am one who— I attend other fellowships other than SAL because I find things that are very helpful for me in those places also. And I think that this is a resource that may be helpful to some of our members, whether they're on the betrayed side or on the addicted side. And, uh, thank you for sharing a little bit about that.

All right. What I'd like to do, Nikitas, is I'd like to read a paragraph from the Big Book, and this is on page 84. Yes. And you've hit some of these things. I just want to go through half of the paragraph. Nope. I'm going to read the whole paragraph. Do you want to read it actually?

Speaker 4: Yeah, sure. I'll read it. Thanks. Hi, I'm Nikith. I'm a sex addict. This thought brings us to Step 10, which suggests we continue to take personal inventory and continue to set right any new mistakes as we go along. We vigorously commence this way of living as we cleaned up the past. We have entered the world of the spirit. Our next function is to grow in understanding and effectiveness. This is not an overnight matter. It should continue for a lifetime.

Justin B.: All right, let's pause there real quick. Or so from that first half of the paragraph, Nikitas, what were some of the words or phrases that have really impacted you in your working of Step 10?

Speaker 4: So I wish Nikki was here. Nikki Young was here and hear her say this: we vigorously commenced this way of living as we cleaned up our past.

Nikitas B.: Right? She would be pounding on that word, vigorously commenced. That's a word, right? Like, I have to vigorously be on this path of, you know, cleaning up my past.

Speaker 4: And then I feel like our next function is to grow in understanding and effectiveness. That's difficult. But it also gives you the next line is that this is not an overnight matter. Like, the Big Book is giving me compassion right there and some empathy. Like, hey, it's not going to be overnight. However, through my experience, it doesn't take that long. It doesn't take that long once you have that willing heart to do that. It might seem like a huge mountain to climb.

Once you got that willingness, it's really not that difficult to stay with it.

Justin B.: Yeah. And I love the phrase here. The very last sentence is one that really hits me. This should continue for our lifetime. Just like with, it's not an overnight matter. It's not going to happen overnight. But guess what? I get to practice it every day so that every, every time I get to, well, let's see what promises or what changes or what insights I have about myself this time. And I love that. Anything else on that before we read the second half of that paragraph?

Okay, go ahead and pick up there.

Speaker 4: Continue to watch. I continue to watch for self, selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear. When these crop up, we ask God at once to remove them. We discuss them with someone immediately and make amends quickly if we have harmed anyone. Then we resolutely turn our thoughts to someone who can help. Love and tolerance for others is our code. That's where I think the spot check comes in. When you talk about the spot check, it's like when these crop up, because they're going to crop up, right?

There's no question. We ask God to remove them at once, and we discuss that with someone immediately. I love, below that last line is love and tolerance of others is our code. So there's a phrase that I heard, I believe it was Monroe shared that a couple years ago, that everyone is trying their best. And that really brings you to a humble place.

Nikitas B.: So I love to bike ride.

Speaker 4: I bike ride almost every day. And on my bike path, I see about 100 people. And a lot of the times I'm in my own head. Sometimes I listen to podcasts, music. Sometimes I go silent. I go silent.

Nikitas B.: I look at everybody that passed and I'm like, that person's trying their best.

Speaker 4: That person's trying their best. That couple tried their best. That mom is trying her best. That dad is trying their best. Then I put the finger back on me and I'm like, I'm trying my best. And that gets me emotional every time because I'm trying my best, even if I'm failing at times. that even if I'm not willing to connect to God, even at that moment, I'm trying my best. Even if someone else is disagreeing with my action, I'm still trying my best, right?

So it brings a lot of humbleness to you.

Nikitas B.: The love and tolerate of others is our code.

Justin B.: I was talking with a sponsee of mine this morning, and we were going through this, continue to watch, going through this process. And I was trying to say, hey, let's dive deep into this Step 10 process. And when I typically teach this, I almost always just use that last sentence as a, all right, this is the last sentence of the paragraph and not really touch on it other than just say, hey, we're working towards love and tolerance of others.

But as I was talking with him this morning and I went, love and tolerance of others is our code. No, that's not just something to cast aside. That is That's like the wrap-up here is I'm practicing these principles, practicing this step. That is the fruit of my labors, the love and tolerance of others, and it has to be recognized and worked toward consistently. And that was one of those light bulb moments for me. I've been in the room since 2013, and I've been really digging into the Big Book in this process here for several years.

And all of a sudden I go, oh, aha, more is constantly Disclosed to you and to us, right? Love that. Yeah. And I appreciate that you really dug deep on it. Thank you. All right. Okay. So, so we've just wrapped up a little bit of that paragraph on step 10. Is there anything else on the process of step 10 you want to talk about? I want to jump into the step 10 promises here in a minute, but let's talk about the process any deeper if you have anything else.

Nikitas B.: Yeah, I, if we continue down On that reading, he talks about we are not fighting it. So he talks about alcohol here. I love how it says, let's just go back to that last paragraph. And we have ceased fighting anything or anything, even alcohol. By this time, sanity will have returned. It'll be seldom interested in liquor, sex, lust, food, whatever it is. If tempted, we recoil from it as a hot flame. We react sanely and normally, and we'll find this as it's happened automatically.

So I want to give an example of this. I experienced this. Okay? So I go to the gym every morning. I love it. It's my safe haven for me. Makes me feel good for the day. And I know the 40 people that are there every morning at 5 o'clock. So there was this new person there, a new woman that was there, and I found myself objectifying. Right. And I go to the cable machines and I call one of my guys and He wasn't there, but I was able to leave a message and I'm basically surrendering on the message.

And as soon as I get off the phone, that woman was right next to me on the next cable machine directly. Like I put the phone down, I get up and everything. She was right there. And I chuckled because the way I looked at it is like, there's God giving me an opportunity. I'm like, I see you, God. I see you, Christ. I see what you're trying to do. And it made me laugh and I picked up.

I wasn't tempted. I recoiled from like a hot flame. So I picked up my stuff and I reacted sanely and normally and just went to the other side of the gym. That would not have happened if I was in my addiction. In the past, I would've sat there and tried to start a conversation because I was looking for any sort of connection for a woman to validate me. That's really what it was all about. I wanted women to validate me, and I don't do that anymore.

And it just happened Just by working the steps naturally, just left.

Justin B.: And that next phrase, and we'll find that this has happened automatically. Now, when it says that, in my mind I think, well, then that should be how I naturally react when that new woman comes into the gym. I shouldn't even notice her. She should be invisible to me. That, to me, that's not reality. Correct.

Nikitas B.: It's not to me either. Like, I— so my default is to look at skin. I look, my eyes just look at skin, men or women. I don't care what it is. I just see skin. I see flesh. So I look and obviously she's beautiful. It's like, oh, okay. I notice. And then I look away and pray. It's really, when I say I pray, I make them human. I make them my sister or my mother. Like they, they too are trying their best and God helped them with whatever they need.

And that's really what my prayer is. Yeah. It's me. Women could do what they want. They could dress however they want. They could say whatever they want because that's their life and they're allowed to live that. But it's me. I need to be acting differently. I need to realize that these women are trying their best, that they're mothers, sisters, aunts, and they deserve respect. And they're not there just for me to objectify them for whatever my own pleasure is, whatever my perverted pleasure is.

That's not what Christ wants for me. And I don't want that for myself either anymore.

Justin B.: Beautiful. Let me continue reading the rest of these Step 10 promises here. Yes. Yeah. We will see that our new attitude toward lust has been given us without any thought or effort on our part. Let's pause there for just a second. How do you experience that?

Nikitas B.: So what I have written down here from my notes is that when we will see our new attitude towards Women validation, that's what I have, has been given to us without any thought or effort on our part. Yeah, I don't— how can I put this? Women are not there for me to objectify anymore. They're like— I don't have the urge. I don't know how to put this. I just don't have the urge anymore to put the effort into that anymore.

What I have the effort into doing, which really gives me purpose, is to be available to newcomers, is to be available to my fellows, is to think of others. That really is it. I don't think I had purpose in my addiction. I thought that my purpose was to make sure my kids are fed. My wife's taking care of everything else. I got to take care of the food in the house, make sure that they're fed and the money's there.

But I just know that it's just not there anymore for me to, to look towards women in that way. And I don't know if that makes sense.

Justin B.: Yeah, it does make sense what you said. And I think one way that I envision this phrase, it's been given without any thought or effort on our part. It just comes my whole life when that woman at the gym showed up. I would either be gawking. Same. Or I would be like white-knuckle. I can't look. I just can't. And I'd be going into the corner and just like gritting my teeth and closing my eyes. All this effort to try and avoid it.

But now, as I'm striving to live in recovery, I react sanely and normally. I don't have to do that. And I don't have to gawk and I don't have to run away and hide in the corner. I can continue my day. And, and that's how I see it.

Nikitas B.: I see that with alcoholics because I know a couple alcoholics that are able to be in functions with alcohol around them and they're not tempted. They're okay with drinks right next to them, right? Yeah, it happens. And I don't— I can't explain how it happened. I just know that I don't have that thinking anymore to be deceiving or deceive someone to want to be with me. Because that's really what it was. I was deceiving people. I'm already in a committed relationship with someone, having kids, and I'm just looking for validation from somebody else.

I would deceive of where I'm at and all this. I'm like, that's too much effort, man. I want to put effort into fellowship, whatever Christ wants to do with me. Just take me.

Justin B.: Yeah, I'm going to continue on this. That's the miracle of it. We are not fighting it. Neither are we avoiding temptation. If I'm an alcoholic and I am in this place, I can be in functions where there's alcohol and not have to, like, white-knuckle it through it. We feel as though we had been placed in a position of neutrality. I love that. Safe and protected. We've not even sworn off. I swear I'm never going to go to the gym again.

Well, who does that help? Yeah.

Nikitas B.: I love it also here. It says it's safe and protected. What I love about that is I love being safe for people now too. I love being able to be that person that people could come to and be safe with me. For instance, because I've been at that one gym for so long, there are women there that have saw me in my addictions and now they see me differently. And I'm not shy about my past. I'm very open about it.

I let anybody know about it. The more I talk about it, the better I feel, the more freer I feel. Yeah. So there's women there now that come to me to talk to me about their spouses and how to handle that. And I'm always looking at the side of empathy and compassion for them and what they're going through and not trying to give that to them in a deceiving way. Like I'm going to get something out of them afterwards.

And the guys too. Like I said, I'm really open about my addiction and it's open with so many women. so many doors for people to come connect with me.

Justin B.: Yeah, it's beautiful. And I'm going to continue in this paragraph. We've not even sworn off. Instead, the problem has been removed. It does not exist for us. We are neither cocky nor are we afraid. That is our experience, and that is how we react so long as we keep in fit spiritual conditions. And I think that's the secret right there. Am I keeping in fit spiritual condition? Nikitas, how do you practice keeping in fit spiritual condition?

Nikitas B.: Thanks for asking. I have a lot of different hobbies that I have now that I didn't before. Like I said, I bike ride every day. I like to color and draw. I like writing. I like cooking. I like meetings and being of service. I know that when I'm not in good spiritual conditioning is when I'm in my own self Thinking. I needed to replace those bad habits because I— it took a lot of time to act out.

I was— it took a lot of time out of my day to act out. So now I had to fill those spots up when I'd been wanting to act out or when I was trying to change that behavior. I had to fill it in with doing better things, commendable acts. And that's what I did. I started Being of service. Like I said, bike riding, coloring, drawing, journaling, being at the meetings when I didn't wanna be at the meetings and doing my step work.

And when I mean my step work, right, 10, 11, and 12. I know a lot of people at these meetings, they share like, oh, what steps they work is 10, 11, and 12. But are you really doing step 10? Are you really writing it out and sending it to someone? Because it's not just between you and God, it's between you, God, and someone else, another human. Are you sending it to somebody else? Are you really praying and meditating? I know here I'm talking like I'm taking someone else's inventory, but it's like, these are the things I ask the guys that I speak to.

Like, I question that. Like, are you really doing that? And what does that look like? Because I want the same things asked about me. My spouse and I, we pray together. That is one of the most profound things I've ever done before. Like, I thought I did that before. Like, no. Not the way we pray. I get really humble about that and ask for specific things. It's amazing. And my Step 12s, I've been all— so I love taking calls.

I have no problem you giving my number out to anyone you want to.

Speaker 4: You're just enough.

Nikitas B.: I practice the steps. That's what it is. I take action in the steps. We did a podcast before about taking action. I'm still in that mentality. When I take action is when I'm in fit spiritual conditioning. When I'm relaxed about it or content where I'm at, that's when I lose myself again. I have to continue working these steps, and it really comes down to 1, 2, and 3, 6 and 7, 10, 11, and 12. You know, 1, 2, and 3 are important. I gotta admit, I am powerless.

Do I believe— if I, if there's something going wrong, well then I have to go back to 1, 2, and 3 because then I'm not believing in my higher power. There's no trust there. Yeah. And when I was in my addiction, I didn't trust my God. I came from a very heavily religious family. I'm Greek Orthodox.

Speaker 4: My dad's a Greek Orthodox priest.

Nikitas B.: I checked all the boxes. However, I did not have the faith in Christ, the trust in Christ that I do now. And that's because I'm open to it. I'm in a mode to receive. And a lot of times I'm closed off. I have to be in a mode to receive Christ. grace, right? If I'm shut off, I'm not going to have any conditioning with him. He's my best friend. He's a 10-foot Christ standing behind me, protecting me when he needs me.

And he's also my dad cradling me, loving me, because I still need my dad to cradle me. And even though my earthy father can't cradle me anymore, he's older and he's living in New York. I still need Christ to cradle me at times.

Justin B.: Nikitas, this is beautiful. And as we wrap this up, the tagline that we have with SAL is recovering individuals, healing families. Thank you for sharing the role that the steps are playing in recovering you as an individual. Do you mind sharing just a little bit about how healing families, that, that looks in your life and in your relationships?

Nikitas B.: I love that you're asking that. So you do know my story. I blew up my marriage 6 years ago, and the D-Day when I got discovered, I had my 10-year-old son cursing and screaming at me, bulging veins on the side. I'll never forget that. I'm gonna get you, Dad. Like, it was traumatic for him. It was traumatic for everybody involved, right? And he didn't want to talk to me for a couple years after that. And my relationship with him now at 16 years old is remarkable.

He just came with me to Thanksgiving with him and my daughter. They talk to me. My son talks to me all the time now. Like he listens to me. He is asking me questions. And the only reason that happened is because I've been vulnerable with him. I've showed him, I tell him my mistakes, I tell him my faults, even when I'm going through it with him. and stuff, or like something's going on, he asks me questions about me.

He asks me about my day and I, and I get vulnerable with him and I tell him where my fear is and all this. And my life has changed completely. My relationships have changed completely. And I feel it's all because of Christ and SAL. And I love the fact about healing families. I just got to say this. The reason I love SAL so much is because they are concentrating on healing families. They are concentrating on the betrayed spouse.

It's so freaking important. This is the analogy I give, right? A car accident. A family could be in a car accident and it's not your fault, right? So my wife, like, it's not her fault that I did the things I did. Her name could have been 10 other different names. I would've done the same exact thing. It's not her. Okay? It was me. However, I caused that damage on her. And she needs to heal from it. And that's what I love that SAL does.

They actually go to the spouse to heal because the betrayed spouse needs healing. I gaslit my wife so much. I threw dishes at her feet. I would gaslight her to the point where I would say, you should just kill yourself. Like, these are the words that came out of my mouth. horrible words. And I did that just to protect my addiction. Like, that's insanity. And I have a wonderful relationship with her now, co-parenting, trying to raise kids.

That's what healing families is, that she's at a better place. I'm at a better place. The kids are at a better place. And we're not perfect at it. I'm sure I've still caused a lot of damage. And so my kids are still going to have to go through their healing on their own. They have their own higher power. As much as I want to try to control their healing, I can't. My son's 16 now. He's trying to be his own man, and I'm just trying to be there for him to come back to.

There is something I want to share when it comes to building safety for families, and this is something I share with the guys I that I speak to. It's an acronym called SAVES. It works tremendously. Uh, I learned it from one of my first sponsors. S-A-V-E-S. I see that you're hurt. I see that you're having a feeling. A, I ask, are you having that feeling? What's going on? V, I validate. It makes sense to me that you would feel that way.

Empathize. E, empathize. I'm sorry my past actions have caused that. And then S, make it safe for them to come back. And that's like, let me know how I could support you. And then shutting up. Like, I'm not Dr. Oz. I am not going to fix anybody. All I want to do for the rest of my life is be safe for the people in my life that I love to come back to me, to ask me to come.

I want to be available. For my kids, my friends, and brothers. I would just want to be— I just want to hold space for them in a safe spot. And I don't want to give advice unless they're asking me for it. And even when they're asking me for it, I'm going to ask them, are you sure you want me to give you advice or suggestion? But that acronym has saved so many relationships, not only with my family, but at work, with friends.

Just to hold space for people and make them trust you that you could hold space for them just changes everything. Has changed everything for me, in my experience, has changed everything with my relationships.

Justin B.: Hey, Keith, this has been an amazing conversation, and thank you for diving deep with me on Step 10 and really on a lot of different aspects of recovery. There's 2 questions that I get to ask at the end of each of these meetings. So what advice or experience do you have to share with one, the newcomer who is either just coming into the meetings now, just been discovered, or just said, you know what, I need help and coming in.

And what do you have to say to somebody who's been around for a long time and maybe thinking about jumping out because he's got it figured out?

Nikitas B.: I think I would say the same thing. Give me a list of things that your addiction has cost you. Even to the old timer, right? What has your addiction cost you? This is what I would tell 'em. And then I would tell 'em to write a love letter to themselves. Like literally sit down on a piece of paper and write a love letter to yourself. Like you're getting a love letter from the most incredible love that you ever had in your life.

Right? My dearest Nikitas, I love you because X, Y, and Z. If you're not crying 2, 3 lines into that, then you're not doing it right. And the reason I like that practice so much is because I like the list of the things that you've lost, but a lot of people sit in the shame and guilt of that, right? However, writing that love letter to yourself also acknowledges all the good things that you are, right? Because as addicts, I know that I am not a bad person.

I've done some bad things. Yeah. I made poor decisions. I made poor choices in my life, very self-indulgent choices in my life. But the truth is I have a huge heart and I love sharing with people. And a lot of times I get misunderstood. So for the newcomer, write a list of things you've lost. And if you haven't lost enough, then go out, keep trying it. You'll come back eventually because life's going to get you. When you're living on your self-worth and write that love letter.

But something else is, I am not perfect in this. I don't think anybody is perfect in this. However, one thing I am is consistent. I am consistent. I might not do my step 10 inventory every single night, right? However, I'm doing it the majority of the time. I'm consistent with it. I might not be doing all the meetings I want to go to. However, I am consistent with it. I'm not doing all the phone calls. However, I am making more.

phone call. I have to stay consistent. And some of— one thing about the old-timers I want to share is if you receive the promises from this program, give it back to somebody else, man. Like, just going to the meeting isn't enough, right? Taking a call once a week isn't enough. Because when I got into the rooms, I was frantic, I was suicidal, I was homeless. I needed help and a few guys that held me together during those first few months that allowed me to get to this point where I feel happy, joyous, and free now.

Justin B.: Nikitas, do you want to pray us out with that 10-step prayer that you shared with me earlier?

Nikitas B.: Yes. This is a card that I found at my in-person men's meeting. It's prayers of all the 12 steps, and this is the 10th step prayer, which I haven't heard before. I pray, I'm gonna say in the we version, we pray that we may continue to grow in understanding and effectiveness, to take daily spot check inventories of ourselves, to correct mistakes when we make them, to take responsibilities of our actions, to be ever aware of our negative and self-defeating attitudes and behaviors.

To keep our willfulness in check, to always remember we need your help, Christ, to keep love and tolerance of others as our code, and to continue in daily prayer how I can best serve you, our higher power. Amen.

Justin B.: Amen. Everybody keep coming back. It works when I work it. So work it. You are worth it.

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