The Impact of Snooping in the Wake of Sexual Betrayal w/ Jill Manning

Narrator: This is Pathway to Recovery, an SA Lifeline Foundation podcast featuring hosts Tara McCausland, who is the SA Lifeline Executive Director, and Justin B., a sex addict living in long-term recovery. We have conversations with experts and individuals who understand the pathway to healing from sexual addiction and betrayal trauma because we believe that recovering individuals leads to the healing of families.

Tara McCausland: Hello, welcome to the Pathway to Recovery podcast. I'm your host, Tara McCausland, and I'm so pleased you're here with us today. This is a unique episode. I'm actually posting a presentation from Dr. Jill Manning from our 2024 SA Lifeline virtual conference. And typically you can only access this through the Digital Recovery Library, which you can find on salifeline.org. But I wanted to share this with you. It's a really unique presentation on snooping, and I think it can be a very helpful perspective for both the betrayed and the betrayer.

So I'm excited to share this presentation with you. Also, I wanted to give you a heads up that registration for our 2026 SA Lifeline Virtual Conference will be live in just 2 weeks. And so I would love to invite you to join our newsletter so that you can be privy to the early bird discount, which will be a hefty discount. Discount for this 2026 virtual conference, which will be November 13th and 14th. And I hope you'll all attend. It'll be a really, really great conference, a great way to get education and motivation in your recovery.

So again, I hope that you'll go to salifeline.org, register for our newsletter so that you can know when registration is live, and happy to share this presentation from Dr. Jill Manning on snooping. Enjoy.

Jill Manning: Hello and welcome. I want to personally thank you for attending this specific webinar of the conference series. I know that the SA Lifeline Foundation has done a stellar job once again of just organizing some highly relevant topics and exceptional speakers. And so I'm grateful that you would choose this webinar and topic. And my hope and goal is that this will be worth your while, that you'll walk away with some new ideas, perhaps some new perspectives, and things that I most of all hope will be helpful, whether you are the person that is betrayed, the person who has betrayed, or you're a coach or a clinician or sponsor that is helping those in the trenches of this.

These are difficult and challenging topics. And so I'm really hoping that you will find benefit in this today. So the topic is the impact of snooping. In the wake of sexual betrayal. And before we get into the meat of this, I wanna give a touch on 2 things to give context as to why I chose this topic. The first is that in the last 2, 3 years, I've noticed a trend on social media. There's many trends on social media, I realize, but one that I've noticed that's caught my eye is that when the topic of snooping comes up or is raised in a comment or a post, I've noticed that it's often very quickly framed as safety-seeking behavior and then dropped.

And the implied message, at least that I take from that, is that we're not to challenge snooping behavior. We're only to validate and accept it as a safety-seeking behavior. And that's it. And having been involved in this work for over 2 decades, I've been involved as a researcher, advocate, advocate, and clinician. I think we have so much more to offer on this topic that can be validating and helpful, but also to help people move in a direction that's more, um, more indicative of solid recovery work that will help people and also relationships long-term in better ways rather than just validating snooping and dropping it and leaving it as it is.

So that's the first thing. The second is that it's been my observation over more than close to 25 years, actually, that those who snoop and persist in that behavior over the long run, they stay stuck in their trauma. They don't heal across the board. I've yet to see any man or woman persist in any snooper behavior long-term that has deeply healed trauma or is thriving in the relationship. It is one of those behaviors that I think is a bit of a canary in the coal mine.

It speaks to attachment issues, self-trust, self-worth, communication styles that aren't working. It's really a litmus test, I think that, or rather a window that lets us peer into other things that are going on that are likely not serving the wellbeing and health of relationships and individuals. So with that, I want to present today information that I have found and used in my own clinical practice and also research that has been helpful as I framed this whole topic.

In this presentation, I'm hoping to do 6 things. The first is I'm going to start with a brief overview of why I support the SAL 12-step model and how those 12 steps tie in with snooping. So there is a direct tie-in here. Secondly, I'm including a detailed handout that anyone listening can access through the Woova dashboard. For organizational purposes only, I'm going to refer to the person who has been unfaithful or sexually compulsive as male and the adult who's been betrayed as female.

This is not to ignore the reality that either gender could be in either role, but For just brevity and organization purposes only. It will be presented from a clinical and research-based perspective. I want to encourage anyone listening to be generous in your self-care today as you listen and also through the whole conference series. These are— can be very triggering topics, especially if someone's early in recovery work or they don't have a good support network in place yet.

So please, if anything that I say inadvertently causes triggering or activation, please take a break and then come back when you're feeling more grounded. And lastly, I'm going to start with the end in mind here with this invitation. My invitation to anyone who is engaged in snooping behavior now to consider healthier alternatives for healing and growth, and also for getting the truth that I do believe people deserve. And, and have a right to, but I believe there's healthier ways than others to obtain that information.

Now, if anyone reacts to that invitation by thinking, oh no, leave it alone. I like my snooping. It works. It gets me the information I need that I wouldn't get any other way. Then I'll say, please just hold maybe some of the seeds of information that you hear today, sit with them. I've This is not to force or tell anyone they're wrong, but just to help people consider and contemplate some healthier alternatives when they're ready. So maybe you're not ready now.

Maybe today just plants the seeds and that's okay. I thank you for being here. And, but for those that are ready, please, you know, take notes of things that resonate with what you'd be ready to move on with the ideas that are shared throughout the presentation. So let's get going. 6 reasons why I refer to the SAL 12-step program, and I regularly refer to them. They're my 12-step community of choice for adults that have been betrayed. Of course, I support the 12-step models generally, and in my therapy groups, I do have adults in AA, NA, Overeaters Anonymous, RCA for couples, Recovering Couples Anonymous, and others.

And so I certainly endorse the 12-step model, but for betrayal, SAL 12-step is my group of choice for the following reasons. I believe they do an excellent job of providing a roadmap for not only individual healing, but couple and family healing, and they're unique in this regard. Secondly, their definition of sobriety, which does align with the SA 12-step group of sobriety, I believe is most honoring of marriages and families. And that is no sex with self or others unless it's with, with one spouse.

They have genders segregated in specific groups. That means men meet with men, women meet with women. And in with the issues of betrayal and sexual compulsivity, it is my professional opinion that that is really the only way To go. It provides a lot more safety for, for everyone involved. Fourth, 12-step supports long-term healing in realistic and sustainable ways. The meetings are cost-free. There's no endpoint to them. So unlike a therapy group that may run for 12 or 15-week cycles, there's costs involved and, and there's certainly benefits.

And there's differences with group therapy that are important and can add to a treatment and recovery plan. But 12-step, one thing I deeply value is just it, it's ongoing. And so that people in long-term recovery work can reap those benefits. The 5th point, which ties in the most directly with our topic today of snooping, is that it helps people and encourages people. It shows them a way to to detach from what they cannot control and to focus on what they can control.

So it helps people get out of cycles of what we call negative control. And that is really important. And often people that are in cycles of snooping are not yet out of those negative control patterns. They're trying to control things that they cannot control long-term or easily. And this is a really important shift. that I've noticed when people can detach from being hyperfocused on the betrayer and trying to control things that are out of their control, they can turn and invest more time and energy into their own healing and deeper work, and we see better results.

The last point I wanna make on this is that it's my professional opinion and also my observation over many years that those that are working earnestly and honestly a 12-step program and the recovery plan that they do better. There's better results. And I think the SAL 12-step program aligns beautifully with evidence-based approaches to care. When I was doing my doctoral research, I interviewed betrayed adults all over the country, including Canada. And I found that there were 5 key factors and common, common factors, I should say, with those that were not just overcoming betrayal, but thriving.

And those were connection, advocacy, validation, education, and direction. And when those 5 are in place, people move, they move forward. And I find that the SAL 12-step model gives one place where all of those components can be obtained in realistic and sustainable ways. What is snooping? Well, the most simple way to define it, if we look to the dictionary, the Merriam-Webster dictionary, is to look or pry In a sneaky or meddlesome manner. Now I realize some of those, that language may sound inflammatory, but hold on.

We're going to, we're going to hopefully validate some of this here shortly. I define it as an attempt to uncover information without confronting someone directly. That's really a key component. And some examples of snooping, this is not a comprehensive list, but key examples that are very common. Searching through someone else's devices, accessing password-protected accounts or documents, reading personal journals or therapeutic workbooks, installing hidden cameras, hiring a private investigator to spy on someone, secretly monitoring someone's location or activity, stalking, eavesdropping, recording video or audio of someone.

Setting discreet traps to detect someone's activity, or asking children about someone's activity, behavior, or conversations. Ethically, I want to point out that several of these examples of snooping, depending on the state, province, or country that you live in, are actually considered illegal. So that's important to keep in mind. One thing that is a common denominator with all of these examples, however, is that all of them are done without a person's permission or knowledge. Now, I'm guessing that some listening may say, well, Jill, that's the point.

It's the point of doing this to try to get information about a situation from someone that I'm not trusting, or I suspect is not being truthful with me, which is one of the main drivers about why people snoop. But let's dig into this a little further. One of the key reasons and common denominators that I've seen in people that are snooping is that they're in pain. And I hope that can be received as validating for anyone that's engaged in this or has in the past.

It's pain that propels us to want to sneak about or meddle in someone's belongings or Or affairs to try to get at the truth. That's painful, stressful, anger-provoking, anxiety-provoking. A lot of big emotions can come up, but if we were to summarize them, they're all forms of pain that typically drive snooping. When we look at why they do this further, like really tease this out, here are some key reasons. They typically suspect someone's not being honest or transparent with them.

They don't trust someone will answer their questions honestly or directly. They've experienced the same person lying to them in the past, or maybe in a past relationship. Something, a pattern is now unfolding in their current relationship that sparked and triggered old fears. They may be impatient or anxious to find something out. They want to confirm or rule out their suspicions. And lastly, they believe they're entitled to certain types of information. But how does snooping impact the snooper?

I first want to pose a question. I'm going to assume that most people listening to this webinar session have snooped at some point in their past or have been snooped on. Whichever side of the coin you have experienced, maybe both, I want you to take a moment and think back about how it felt. Like, notice what happens in your mind, spirit, or body when you think back to a time you were snooping or being snooped on.

What emotions come up? What visuals in your mind come up? Do you visualize yourself doing What objectively may look or seem like some pretty crazy or extreme things to get information. And also notice in your body. My guess is that there's usually tension, tightness, fear response, anger. This isn't a pleasant activity. This is by no means relaxing, but I would invite you to, to just take notice of what comes up for you as you think about a memory of snooping or being snooped on.

I'm going to categorize the effects of snooping on the snooper in 2 key ways, short-term and over time. To start with short-term impacts, snooping, we know, can temporarily, for many people, maybe not all, it can evoke feelings of empowerment, feeling like he's not going to get the— pull the wool over my eyes this time. No one's going to fool me. And it feels like we're acting and doing something. That's helping us. It can temporarily feel like it's providing us reassurance, even if the reassurance is false or an illusion.

It can satisfy very natural self-protective instincts. This ties in with what I mentioned earlier about safety-seeking behaviors, and it can also satiate the need for control. Again, feeling like we're doing something and taking action on something that is distressing. But over time, and how I'm defining over time is any point past confirmation that someone has betrayed you. Once you've found some evidence or have been told, or, you know, there's a history of this, any point beyond that can slip into the impacts that I'm going to outline now.

So we're no longer talking short-term. Over time, which could for some be days, weeks, months, or years, the fight or flight response will remain in high gear. It's almost impossible to be snooping and to be in a relaxed, grounded state in the body. Therefore, cortisol levels will stay elevated in the body, and this wreaks havoc on metabolism, weight, sleep. And the nervous system's ability to settle. Therefore, active trauma symptoms such as hypervigilance, which snooping could be classified as a form of, are exacerbated or prolonged.

There's also a risk of additional trauma when someone's snooping because they're at risk of directly encountering material that is distressing. I've lost count of the number of times people have said to me, Jill, when I found that sext or text or image or pornographic website, I cannot get that out of my head. It's imprinted in my brain. So snooping can be a very real risk factor for secondary trauma. And exhaustion. When we're doing this hypervigilant, stressful activity and behavior, exhaustion eventually sets in.

It's not sustainable and it can evoke depressive symptoms over time. It also will heighten mistrust of others because we're focusing on untrustworthy behavior and also mistrust of oneself because we're focused on external evidence versus trusting our own gut. We're focused on the betrayer and the focus on that and having him be the center. Is prolonged and we delay the investment in self-care, safety work, or boundaries. And I really deeply respect how SAL 12-step encourages betrayed adults to, as soon as they are able, to shift focus and detach from having the betrayer or addict in some cases be their center.

With snooping, an indirect and ineffective communication style gets reinforced and rehearsed. Therefore, it grows stronger. And victim offending is heightened. Victim offending occurs when the snooper feels entitled to snoop or to do something wrong, or perhaps even illegal because they've been hurt by the person they're snooping on. Almost like two wrongs make a right here. Uh, and this victim offending can, in some cases, not all, in some cases, really lead to even abusive behavior on the part of the betrayed adult.

It also gives us a false sense of control, which we've referred to earlier as negative control, because we're trying to control something outside of ourselves or find information that is out of our control. We can't control someone else's choices or behaviors. Therefore, valuable energy is wasted doing the betrayer's work. Think about that for a minute. When I am compelled and bent on, I'm going to find out the truth. I'm basically over-functioning and enabling the betrayer not to come forward and tell the truth because he's going to get the message that I'll do the work for him.

I'll do the sleuthing so he doesn't have to work on distress tolerance of learning how to be honest because I'm going to do the work for both of us. Which is part of why an immature stance toward getting our needs and wants met gets reinforced because instead of letting people show up as functional adults, I'm doing the work for both people, and I'm trying in a sneaky way to get my needs met rather than just being direct and open and upfront about this.

And lastly, it heightens feelings of frustration and powerlessness because snooping as a primary form of self-protection is not effective nor sustainable. And I believe that all of us deep down know it. We know. that this is not a long-term healthy behavior to engage in. So these are many of my clinical observations, but there's actually been research done on snooping. And I want to share one study in particular that I, that highlighted a really fundamental dynamic that I think drives much of the very intense snooping that we see clinically.

This is a study that was done at the University of Houston, and it was titled The Price of Distrust: Trust, Anxious Attachment, Jealousy, and Partner Abuse. It was conducted in 2015, and it looked at 261 adults who were in committed relationships. And I'm just pulling one quote that I want to highlight to make an overarching point here with this presentation. The quote states, Upon experiencing distrust in one's partner, anxiously attached individuals are more likely to become jealous, snoop through a partner's belongings, and become psychologically abusive.

Now, whoa, that's saying a lot. That, um, I'm guessing there may be strong and diverse reactions to that quote. But what is this getting at? What does it mean to be anxiously attached? Anxious attachment is marked by a fear of abandonment, a strong need for reassurance, and discomfort with too much independence or space in a relationship. There's 4 main styles of attachment: secure attachment, which we would consider the healthiest, most stable form of attachment in relationships. Anxious attachment, which is, as this definition states, is a very intense fear of losing the relationship or needing a lot of reassurance, more than average.

Avoidant attachment. And I will say it's been my observation that avoidantly attached individuals tend to be less likely to, and I make realizing this is a generalization, but they do tend to be less likely to snoop because they're avoiding any data. That would confront or challenge their need to either have the relationship just be status quo or, um, any other idea that they have about the relationship. So they'll avoid that. And then you have what, what we call sometimes fearful avoidant or disorganized attachment.

That's when someone has a bit of both anxious and avoidant styles going on. Women tend to be more likely to have anxious attachment than males. That doesn't mean men can't be anxiously attached. They can be, but statistically it's less likely. So it is common in our clinical work with betrayed adults to encounter a female betrayed adult with anxious attachment who's more likely to snoop as a result than more securely attached or avoidantly attached females. If you are curious about where your attachment style falls, you are welcome to do a free attachment style survey and assessment at the Attachment Project, and their website is wwwattachmentproject.com.

It will basically— they do a beautiful job of administering the Experiences in Close Relationships Scale, which is a valid, incredible attachment style measure. And then at the end of that, you'll be sent a report that outlines where your attachment style is falling and some tips and suggestions as to how to work with that and improve it. So I hope, I hope this point makes sense is that what I'm trying to drive home here is that snooping is driven more than just trauma or fear of someone being unfaithful to us.

There can be attachment style that compels and drives some of this. And unless that's addressed and dealt with, someone will be more likely to continue snooping behaviors over the long haul, and it will really wreak havoc in their recovery work long-term. Snooping, of course, doesn't just impact individuals. It also impacts relationships. So what does it do to relationships? Let's start first with what healthy relationships involve and look like. Healthy relationships are rooted in safety, honesty, Consistency or congruence, trust, vulnerability, the ability to be deeply open with their partner, and openness.

These are also ingredients for secure attachment, being able to count on someone being able to turn toward us and us being able to turn toward them with these virtues and characteristics safely in place. Anything that significantly moves a relationship Or people in a relationship away from these traits and virtues is detrimental to healthy attachment over time. So anything that's pulling one or both partners away from these characteristics is going to do damage to a relationship. Ongoing snooping behaviors, in my opinion, do just that.

They pull people away. From secure attachment characteristics. And when we look at this more deeply, here are some— they have 3 different slides here showing what happens to relationships when snooping by one or both parties is ongoing. Mutual mistrust is heightened. Respect is decreased. Reactivity is increased. Volatility, heightened emotion. The relationship stays stuck. Indirect, immature, and ineffective communication styles are also reinforced because we're not being open and direct with one another. Dishonest behavior is enabled, sending the message to the betrayer that he doesn't need to come clean because she'll do the work of finding the truth out for herself.

This is really important to think about. That the person snooping, who in most cases has been hurt and violated, they're actually enabling the person, the unfaithful party to continue to not be honest by doing the work for him. That's a really unhelpful cycle to be in. This is in no way blaming or making a false equivalency between sexual betrayal and snooping. I'm not doing that. But I wanna highlight that the snooping behavior does enable and doesn't— it gives very unhelpful messages to the addict or unfaithful party.

In a healthy relationship, let's go back to that. Both partners, he and she in a heterosexual relationship, uphold good boundaries. And I'm representing good boundaries Here with the green circle. Both of them together in partnership protect the integrity of the relationship, and they turn toward one another for their primary relational needs. And that turning toward is represented by the blue arrows in this diagram. That's the ideal. In a healthy relationship, people are not perfect. They make mistakes.

They may disappoint or even hurt one another, but there's an ability Most times than not to repair, to come back, to apologize, to be accountable, to make amends where we're like, hey, I'm going to do this better. This was wrong of me. I'm sorry. Let me make this right. In a distressed relationship, however, especially where there's betrayal or addiction occurring, one or both partners turn away That's represented by the red arrows. And the red dotted line is representing distress rather than that solid, healthy green circle.

We have a distressed relationship and they turn away from one another and they go outside the relationship or outside that partnership to get their primary relationship needs met. So if someone is sexually acting out to seek validation or a dopamine hit outside of the relationship, And what, for whatever's driving that, whether that's addiction or poor character or whatever may be driving that, that's naturally and logically going to do harm to the relationship. But likewise, when someone snoops, they're also going outside the relationship for the reassurance or proof or clarity of what's happening.

Does that make sense? Again, we're not making a false equivalency between those behaviors, but that Both of them are turning outside of one another because it's a distressed relationship for what they're seeking or needing. So what's the solution? Well, when a betrayed adult is working a program of recovery, they're working the 12 steps, individual therapy. They know daily what they need to do to stay in a good, healthy zone, whether that— and they know their serenity, if you will.

She will hold firm safety boundaries. That's what I'm representing by the green circle again, while engaging in direct communication represented by the blue line. So she starts practicing again, direct, open communication with him. Her needs and expectations are communicated clearly and responsive actions or consequences are taken and made. If there are continued signs of untrustworthiness, dishonesty, or betrayal. We are not— I am never asking anyone to be unsafe or to not hold the bar very high with their expectations for the need and right to truth and honesty.

She communicates that directly though, and openly rather than going behind and under and around to get that truth indirectly. She's speaking this clearly. And congruently directly to him. The betrayed partner strives to step out of and intercept any patterns of over-functioning or enabling. She is no longer giving him the message that she's going to do the work for both of them and get the truth her own way or style. She's expecting that to come directly from him.

Now, some may be saying, yeah, but what if he's not truthful? What if he's active in his addiction? What, what if, what if, what if? Okay. This is where we're going to get into healthier alternatives to snooping. If those destructive behaviors and addictive behaviors, even abusive behaviors are continuing, we want her to focus on self-care and actively nurture the connection to her own gut. When we snoop, we're placing our trust in external evidence. Versus being attuned to what our gut is telling us.

That's really key. An example I want to use of this is there was a woman I worked with many years ago who was a big snooper. She was anxiously attached and she was big into trying to control him and control the situation because she was terrified of losing the family unit as she knew it. Made sense. She would search and search and search, and she had her goat tracks and ways and, and, and all her Jedi tricks for how she would get to the truth.

And one time she was, she felt, she said to me, I feel a lot of, I feel reassured that he's no longer engaging in his behaviors because she hadn't found what she was convinced she would find. But as it turns out, in the disclosure that we had in subsequent weeks following that conversation, He had purchased a burner phone that she knew nothing about. He was active in his addiction, but had gotten better at hiding this and having it go underground.

She had placed so much trust in external evidence and trust in her snooping that she had lost that connection to her own gut. And after the disclosure, slowly, as we got more and more grounded, she was able to admit that deep down, She didn't feel total peace or serenity with the evidence that she didn't find, um, and that she wished and regretted that she hadn't trusted her gut more. Second is to use effective boundaries to keep yourself safe while any unknowns remain unknown.

If you're feeling off, if you're not feeling deep down like someone's shooting straight with you, you have a right and responsibility to set appropriate boundaries accordingly until that gets cleared up. We want people to put energy into exploring why are they staying in a relationship long-term with someone whom you don't trust enough to give you straight answers. Now, I'm not talking a day or a week. If over a period of time persistently someone's not showing good recovery, they're persisting in patterns of lying or acting out, and we're continuing to snoop.

We need to break that cycle by really asking some deeper questions here about what's going on and what we're avoiding facing by continuing the snooping rather than asking the bigger, larger meta questions such as, why am I staying with someone that I deep down don't believe is being truthful with me? Let your partner know directly that you sense something is off. And that until that's cleared up, you will not be comfortable engaging in X or Y.

Put the onus on the unfaithful party to clear things up. If he's unwilling to do so, this gives you important data about his capacity and readiness to be in a mature relationship that's in recovery. If he's not acting out and he's in, let's say he's sober. Mm-hmm. And she suspects he's not. If he's working a good program of recovery and he's gaining the skills of secure attachment, it will also give you good information about where he's at.

If he can turn towards you, reassure, and take steps to, to show in some way why the suspicion is not true. Some people can request a polygraph test to be taken to address the issue at hand. That may not be a fit for everybody, but I want to outline it here as a choice. And it is one way that people will incorporate that into other skills and resources. I don't ever want polygraph to be a singular way to get at the truth.

Um, we want to be building that internal gut, but if it can add and reinforce what the gut is telling us, it can be a useful resource. Put energy into preparing a full therapeutic disclosure. And include some of the fears and suspicions in the form of questions in the disclosure document. In the disclosures that I facilitate, to be clear, I do limit questions for the partner to 8 to 10 so that we're not— when there's lists and lists of questions, I deem that a trauma response and that someone's not ready for disclosure.

So we can fine-tune and really whittle down what are the core themes most needed and deemed most helpful in healing. in the disclosure questions. So again, we're not wanting anyone to be in an FBI role with lists and lists and lists of questions. That indicates still too much trauma that needs to be addressed before we're in the disclosure phase. If you are post-disclosure, decide soon after, like within days or weeks after the disclosure, if there's commitment to stay in the relationship, decide on a protocol together.

In advance of any suspicions as to how the two of you want to deal with things that may come up or get wobbly. What's going to be the process for dealing with that? Will that be bringing those concerns up in couples therapy, bringing them up in a check-in? Decide in advance. That can be a really helpful tool. Discuss your suspicions aloud with a trusted confidant who's supportive of your healing. And I want to add, Hopefully in recovery themselves or understands recovery, that they're not going to just enable and validate you in continuing the snooping.

So I hope some of those ideas are helpful. And I again want to invite you to consider which ones are right for you. Not all of those will fit for everybody's situation or circumstances, and that's okay. But I wanted, I purposely gave lots of choices so that people can decide and know that there's lots of options for getting truth. That is deserved and entitled to, but in healthier ways and more open and direct ways. So let's say we have someone that's in good recovery.

They're working on building more secure attachment in their relationship and getting out of patterns of avoidance or anxiety, anxious attachment, I should say. I chose phrases here on these next couple of slides that indicate That sound like and represent the posture and stance of someone who's in good recovery, kind of a recovered snooper, if you will. Someone that's really working a program will disengage from those patterns of snooping that keep us stuck in active trauma. They'll still honor their need for truth.

And some of the statements that I hear people say and represent and reflect in their Or I should say represent in their healing are things like, quote, I am inherently worthy and I matter. Someone who really deeply believes they matter is not going to be climbing stairs in the middle of the night, sneaking in the dark to get a phone, hiding in the bathroom or with a nightlight searching. That's not— that's a very fear-based, anxious posture.

People that are working good recovery know they deserve to be treated with respect. They know that they need and expect full honesty and integrity in their relationships. They give full honesty and integrity in their relationships. So we're no longer sneaking around. We're coming directly and openly to the relationship with our concerns and suspicions. They know that they are only responsible for their own actions and not the choices of someone else. And they're very clear that they will not do someone else's work or do what someone else can do themselves.

If someone over time truly is showing and demonstrating to us that they will not be honest, they're refusing to be honest or continuing in deceptive patterns, we have choices as to what we want to do with that information that don't involve snooping. We can hold our head high and really stay above the fray. I think snooping keeps us in a very living below ourselves state. And I do not say that to shame or criticize anyone. Deep down, if you check in with yourselves, I've not met anyone that deeply felt good about themselves or felt good after snooping, even if they did find evidence.

Um, we'll talk more about that in a few minutes. To close this up, I also want to share these last 4 with you that represent the stance of a betrayed adult in solid recovery. They also believe and live life in a way that shows that they trust. I trust myself to uphold healthy boundaries and to take responsive actions when my boundaries are violated. I don't need to snoop. When and if data comes across my path that indicates something's off or wrong, I trust myself to act on that, to ask questions, to set boundaries that will get the information that I need rather than skulking in the dark and, and even doing things that may be illegal to get that.

I surrender what is out of my control. I can honor my needs by asking questions openly and directly, and I can establish safety for myself. So these, these core beliefs or postures, if you will, of recovery, they're, they're the opposite of the mindset of a snooper. Or even if a snooper believes some of these things, it's— these represent the opposite of the ways in which someone is living and carrying out their healing work. So I also want to share some quotes today that I'm hoping will Spark some reflection.

And I am clear that not everyone's going to have the same reaction to these quotes. You may dislike some of them and that's okay. You may love some of them and that's okay. Whatever, whatever it evokes in you, take note of it. Jot down what you like or dislike, what resonates or doesn't. And so I'm just really offering these for For it to generate and spark discussion and either within your coupleship, within our group discussion after this webinar, uh, or just in your own self-reflection and healing work.

Okay. So quote number 1, this is from Michelle Pava, who's a psychotherapist and neuromarketing strategist. And she's quoted as saying, quote, snooping means you lack trust in yourself. People will say that it's the other person that they do not trust, but in snooping, we are actually feeling like we are not enough. It is a self-love and self-trust issue. Okay, so sit with that. What resonates? What doesn't? What, what do you agree with? What don't you and why?

Take a moment. The next quote is by Jace Lindgren, a relationship coach. Who said, quote, the hard truth is that there is never a positive outcome from snooping. It can only hurt. Only 2 things can happen when you open the Pandora's box of snooping. One, you find something incriminating. Technically, this is what you were looking for in the first place, but it won't make you feel good. Or you don't find anything. And are left wondering if they just did a good job of hiding it.

If you value your relationship, snooping will only damage that. And again, sit with it. What do you agree with? Disagree with? What resonates? The third quote is by Janet Zinn, who's a couples therapist. She states, if you are snooping around, are you prepared for what you find, instead of lurking around like a creeper, go in the front door. In this quote, I personally love the language of going in the front door. To me, that summarized beautifully and represented that direct, open style of communication, that mature stance of expecting our partners and ourselves to be open and honest, And if one partner is not being truthful and is being deceptive and unfaithful, go in the front door still and see the data that you get.

See what your gut's telling you. Set healthy boundaries if you're suspecting or know that something is deceptive or off. Now, this last quote needs a bit of an explanation. I included Snoop Dogg in this In this webinar, I felt like I had to, uh, because every time, and you can try this yourself, if you go on and Google quotes or information or research about snooping, you will, I'm sure, find what I found. You can't get away from Snoop Dogg quotes or pictures or images.

They're just there. So especially post-Paris 2024 Olympics and, and his, uh, What shall we say? Fame at the Olympics. I thought this was appropriate timing, but I do love this quote by him. Do what your heart tells you is right. And I think that's a nice way to close this webinar too, because I know that this information will sit differently for different people who are at different wide, diverse range of healing work and where you're at in recovery.

And that's okay. So do what is right for you. But I will ask and invite again that you consider maybe new information, new ideas you hadn't thought about from the information I presented today, and even some of the research about attachment. Just let it sit, let it germinate, and perhaps discuss it in your 12-step group or with your sponsor, a trusted friend or therapist if you need help deciding. How to detach or let go of some of those behaviors and how to deal with the fears that may result in the vacuum as a result.

The final thing I want to say and close with is a message to trust your, trust your gut. I really do believe our gut is our superpower. And when we're walking a spiritual walk and getting very clear on what we can and can't control, I think our gut Is such a magnificent home base. With that said, I'm well aware that when we are in trauma, we get very disconnected from that home base. And so that is why grounding work, safety work, getting good boundaries in place is just so fundamental and foundational in betrayal trauma healing work, because without that, it's going to be almost impossible to get clear.

Still grounded to even know what your gut is telling you. So, uh, if you're not there yet, please keep going. Please keep doing the work. And, um, but no, it, maybe you just hold that out as I want to get to the point where I really can deeply trust my gut again, or perhaps for the first time. And to close, uh, I just want to thank you again for participating and choosing this webinar in the, in this conference series.

I hope it has been worthwhile and I hope the reflections and things I asked you to think about, uh, can bear good fruit in your own healing work. Thank you again and all the best.

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